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I just looked at some of the pics from the Bowling Green event on the PDGA site. It says this is one of the oldest events in PDGA history. Claimed to be the Daytona 500 of Disc Golf. I was a little confused about some of the Pictures. From my interpretation of the rule book Atier events require shirts with a collar, or cool-dri type shirts. Like Nike, Huk lab, asics, and Under Armor produces. Its nice to see in the biggest oldest event that the TD's and Players didn't have enough respect for the game to follow one of the easiest rules in the book, but that's just my take.

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Yes, Dave Gentry is with the PDGA and made the call on who was in the same pools. When you have an event where the final results will be based on scores from players in more than one pool who may never face each other without a shuffle, then pools will be seeded so that the top players more likely to win will be playing in the same pool and weather conditions. Fair competition trumps player ratings and one has to give at BG. If the event was longer and had more rounds, then the pools would likely have been set fairly even in ratings so that players with similar scores would be shuffled together after a few rounds on the same layouts so they could finish together. That's how it works at Worlds.

Your rating does not determine how well you play in the future nor does it prevent you from playing up a division. So if some new players get somewhat lower ratings due to tougher weather on the same layout, that's actually a bonus because you might get to play a few events in a lower division and win something before being forced to move up to your actual skill level. That's if you choose to do so.
Thanks guys, I was curious...because it didn't seem right and there were alot of angry people. I, of course, realize that your rating has nothing to do with how well you play. I just thought I would try to understand this more, especially since there were so many people angry about it.

Knowing what I now know, I do think that someone should have ensured that there were enough 800+ rated players in EVERY pool, to ensure the best, most accurate possible results. Perhaps this is something that can be looked at in the future.
The best most accurate results for the "competition," which is why we do these events, occur when the contenders are in the same pool. Ratings are a bonus result not a goal of competition although we realize how important many members feel ratings are. If a token group of 5 or so 800 props were put with the new players, it wouldn't have mattered because the official ratings would still have been produced from the scores of both E & F pools. On balance, members seem to prefer it when everyone gets the same rating at an event for the same score. Even if there are significant diffferences in weather between rounds, we get more complaints when the ratings are not the same for the same score on the same course in an event.
Chuck, I guess I don't see where having a rating suddenly means that you are more of a contender than someone who doesn't. I have seen unrated players smoke the field in various divisions. (Sadly, I've never been that guy : )

I know, no matter what someone is unhappy, but the point I am making is that the weather should play a factor in the rating a player earns as a result of his or her play. Shooting a 54 on a calm day and shooting a 54 in a snow storm or pouring rain takes two different skill levels. Anyway, that's my two cents.
I don't disagree. But to meet all of the conditions that are best, the event couldn't happen like it does. Better ratings would require those with known ratings to be in different pools. Better competiton requires them to be in the same pool. Players without ratings arguably should not be in the top rated pool because they could be "baggers" until their ratings are known. It's not necessarily a fair nor good thing if they smoke the field. No question that it's more fair to do a shuffle but that means more rounds and/or fewer players. Having only one pool of players for each division is also more fair but that means fewer could play BG. Requiring players to have ratings to play in an A-tier would mean that group of Rec players couldn't enter. There are decisions and tradeoffs everywhere.

If ratings being slightly off for new players is the worst deal in this event, that seems pretty minor in the scheme of things considering the alternatives. Also, it sounds like the wind differences may have balanced out overall since everyone was playing at the same time and experienced those conditions even if on a different course. I realize White is more open but you played four rounds. The variance overall will be less than 2-3 points for the event even if it's a little more than that for a single round.
I appreciate the info, and the fact that you take the time to get on here and clear the air regarding PDGA related stuff. I understand the trade offs, but still disagree that spreading some rated folks into all pools as token props would affect the quality of competition, especially when playing in the same division. Thanks again Chuck. Gotta run.
Had I been doing the pools I likely would have gotten at least five props in the F pool just knowing people would be upset they didn't see unofficial ratings all weekend... ;-)
i just got a sweet polo from itsparked.com, its super comfortable and i bought it in a Large so it wont be restricting at all.
I agree with this completely!!
The PDGA set up the pools for an A tier PDGA tournament in which players paid for a current PDGA membership just to be eligible to play plus an entry fee and expect to at least get their rating.

It seems like the PDGA could have at least set the pools up with at least the 5 required players with a rating over 800 to pull the pool rating. After all the ODGA sets the rules and you would at least expect the PDGA to know what it takes to pull a rating for a pool in advance but as always the new players, women and Jr's were all grouped together in the left over pool which included all nonrated rec, all women, and Jr's. I am still hopefully awaiting the unofficial results to show with all players actually getting ratings.

I think this view on women, nonrated aka new players and Jr's by grouping them together as left overs is why it is so hard to fill these positions in the tournaments. We only had 4 women in the int. and adv. field combined.

Hopefully in future tournaments this can be looked at more carefully to avoid this issue as this has happened to me in other A Tier tournaments in the past such as the 2008 ATL Open in which all women were set on seperate teepads which with the cut off rating being 800 none of the int. women could pull a rating. If given the choice of ratings or shorter tee's we would have all rather had the rating. This is important to the players.

I think the reason happens is this is not educated to enough TD's prior to tournaments being held and taken into consideration! Hopefully this can not become a trend.

Just my 2 cents as well.


The Rudibaughs said:
especially since there were so many people angry about it.
Knowing what I now know, I do think that someone should have ensured that there were enough 800+ rated players in EVERY pool, to ensure the best, most accurate possible results. Perhaps this is something that can be looked at in the future.
The Rudibaughs said:
First off, a big Congratulations to Blaine! Well done!

So does anybody have any insight on why they didn't payout 50% of each division and why the payouts were so lame for anyone that didn't win? I was in the top 3rd of my division and didn't get anything...I didn't mind, cause I played like crap and didn't deserve anything, but I know MANY people were angry about the payout. I think they gave 1 disc to alot of people and it was one that was already in the player's packs.
The PDGA requirement is 45%, not 50%. The payout sucks at Bowling Green Ams because they take out so much for Bowling Green Pros. Don't expect the PDGA to do anything about it if they fell short. The PDGA collects $2500 in player fees from that tournament and a several dozen new members.
The good tournament in Kentucky is the Lexington Open. Bowling Green Ams is the King's New Clothes of tournaments. When you look at it objectively, its just a big am-scam. It is one stop shopping for a Worlds invitation and a must play tournament if you want to compete for the obelisk. And that's only because everyone is going because they think everyone is going.
There's no way to produce unofficial ratings for the players who don't have them right now. However, everyone who played at BG will get official ratings at the mid-May update when we're able to combine scores from multiple rounds and propagators who played the same courses, even at different times.
WHEN IS IT NOT WINDY IN BOWLING GREEN....................Saturday was dead calm!!!! I too have never played there with no wind until saturday. It really screwed with me, all my practice was in crazy ass wind and than there was none.

About the Collared shirts, I wore them every day except saturday and only because I had just bought a cool ass Tye Dyed shirt from Gateway the night before and wanted to look like a Hippie!!!!!!!! Otherwise I had collared shirts packed for every day I was there including the 2 days before. Believe it or not most everyone in Advanced had them on.

Mark Stephens said:
First, when it is not windy at BG AMs? LOL

Second, why do you think that the PDGA had ANYTHING to do with what players played in what pools????

Third, your player ratings is not determined by the PDGA ratings of the players you are playing with on any given day. It does not matter if you shoot with 1000 rated players or 950 rated players. I am sure that Chuck can tell you this in great detail. Also, all the ratings that you now see are the preliminary ratings. They will change once the TD report is turned in telling who played what courses on what days.

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