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I've gotten a chance to throw two grooves of totally different stabilities now (one flippy, one stable to over-stable) and I'm not very impressed by either one. Is it just me or is the disc not very fast? It's rated speed 13, but I'd say with certainty that it doesn't cut through the air as fast as an xcal destroyer, force, or boss. I'm throwing my surge farther than the groove everytime and that is hitting the right line to get both discs to "hook-up."

Is this anybody else's experience?

Oh, and it's supposed to have the most glide of any disc innova makes and I didn't find this portion of the flight to very good either.

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I'd have to agree with Rescue. When I first got my Groove, it seemed like just another disc. After working with it for a bit, I found that it worked great for certain shots, but not so much for others. That seems to be the way it is for most discs. If it doesn't work for one thing, often it works great for something else. I say just give it time. Take it out to the course and play a round with just your Groove. I'm almost willing to guarantee you'll learn something about it, and probably find a use for it...
I like my first-run champ groove. It is light (166g) and still overstable.

The size of the rim is making me change my grip a little, to get a better grip on the disc and generate the needed speed and spin, the disc demands to hold a line and go. So my control is not the best since I am gripping the disc a little different so I use the disc for open field bombs. I'm getting better with it though.

The groove seems to be a little more "nose up" sensitive for me. But, even with a bad "nose up" shot I'm getting good distance.

What I'm looking for in the groove is an ultra fast driver that is light enough to benefit from a tail wind and I think the groove is that disc. Once it gets beat up I'll see how that works out.
I have short fingers also and I've found the Bonopane grip to really help me grip the wide rimmed discs. Might want to try it: http://www.innovadiscs.com/tips/davesgripsmain.html#specialty
I love my groove. Its really predictable, super fast (i think faster than my xcal or destroyer) and it sails forever.
I'm Throwing a 168 gram Groove and it's still fast and stable. It's Blue if that makes any difference.
Most likely not, but as you know. Innova has a pretty crappy track record when it comes to making a consistant run. I have a flippy Boss an overstable Boss and one thats in between!
I'm sure it does...
Like you, I got myself a groove thinking it'd be a less overstable Boss. I tried the Boss and just couldn't get the same concise results I could get with my Destroyer. I really can't get any extra distance off the groove throwing backhand. I feel my hands may be too small for such a wide rim to make the snap I need. I have no trouble getting an Xcaliber going on its predictable hyzer path, but that rim is really only slightly beefier than a destroyer. The groove's is huge and somewhat uncomfortable for me.

Forehand however.. It is my new favorite disc. :) With the 2 finger power throw I can easily get the snap necessary to get this Groove on an nice flight path with decent control. By decent I mean I'm just starting to throw forehand so any control works for me! Hopefully I'll be substituting some of these throws in for where I would normally be throwing anheisers and need a little more distance soon..

So yes a complaint and an endorsement. Ultimately though, I think we all know that it's whatever disc works best for you that matters. So trying it out won't hurt ya.

-Ian
I've thrown 2 different Eco Star Grooves both different weights. One was 175g and the other 171g. I have also thrown the Champion ones in almost every weight from 175 down to 167. !70 is the only weight I haven't thrown. Some were Flippy and others were crazy Overstable. The sad part is the Flippy ones were in the heavier weights. This disc just doesn't make any sense. The only reason I have held on to one in the first place is for severe head winds(25+mph). Otherwise I think it is total crap. The flight path sucks, unless you are throwing in fairly wide open fields. If you are confined in the woods it just doesn't work. Plus I feel like I have to throw my arm out of socket to even get it to fly correctly. Innova gets an F on this one!!!!
It's a 170g btw.
I have the same situation with weights. I've got a 174g blue champ and a 167g orange champ and the 174g is very, very flippy whereas the 167g is fairly overstable. To have a disc vary that much between runs is a little rediculous in my mind. I know this isn't the only disc or manufacturer to have this problem though so I guess I shouldn't just hate on one disc for this issue. Only problem with the groove is that I don't like either stability!
After a while of having my Champ 168g groove, and scoring a new champ 174g groove, im starting to dislike them both. The heavier one is WAY flippy. I'll throw them both on the same hole just for giggles, and the lighter flies "ok", but now that its beat, it too likes to flip sometimes. But the heavier one flips right over and turns into a roller throw. And on a tight course, might as well just leave it in the car, as there is NO consistency nor accuracy from this disc. On longer holes that I religiously relied on my Destroyer or Wraith to get me into deuce range, I use the groove and end up with bogey at best, because my upshot usually is coming from somewhere other than the clear landing zones.

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